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Dr Mariano in terms of bodyweight what dose of armour thyroid would you recommend per lb of bodyweight as a ideal long term dose for people in general?
I am 198-200lbs and 6″4.
One more question i have is to what extent will hypothyroidism cause a malabsorbtion of nutrients since everything including your GI tract becomes more sluggish?
On my 2nd hair analysis all my minerals seem on the low end yet ive been supplementing with many of them to get my levels up (manganese, molybdenum, selenium etc…)
Also when i lie down i notice particularly numbness such as sometimes my whole leg going numb or just the foot.
Dr. M
is there any connection between possible food allergy and high antibodies (besides possible gluten, dairy)?
@MetalMX 245 wrote:
Dr Mariano in terms of bodyweight what dose of armour thyroid would you recommend per lb of bodyweight as a ideal long term dose for people in general?
I am 198-200lbs and 6″4.
I am not a doctor.
I am not trying to answer your question, that is up to DrMariano.But I came with my own guidelines while studying this subject
and possibly DrMariano could combine the two and give comments to both.My guidelines while supporting with thyroid hormones.
In sequence of importance:
RT3 in lower half of range
TotalT3 in upper 1/3 range
TotalT4>bottom range
FreeT3~400pg/dL or higher if TotalT3 not reached
Body temperature (97.8 – 98.2F) (36.56 – 36.78C); (36.6-37C)(97.9-98.6F)
TSH>0
I Armour Thyroid is used, 3grains is a pause point.
3GrainsArmout=~2GrainsArmour + 25mcgCytomel(T3)=1GrainArmour+ 2x25mcgCytomel(T3)Combination or Armour(T4+T3) and Cytomel(T3) may be need to obtain desirable results
Ferritin(100-150)ng/dL
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Approx. Dose Equivalent
http://www.armourthyroid.com/con_faqs.aspx#q4
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Reason for condition:
RT3 in lower half of range
I figured out here:
http://musclechatroom.com/forum/showpost.php?p=35410&postcount=47
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Condition:
TotalT3 in upper 1/3 rangewas discussed in recent LEF magazine,
cant find the link.After reviewing your thyroid results proper thyroid intervention should be commenced if the adrenals are in proper condition. The neuropathy you may be experience could be from the lack of blood flow due to low functioning thyroid. If this does not get treated properly then over time the nerve damage may possible be come constant and this is what we want to avoid at all costs. To bring down antibodies up to 400 mcgs of selenium methione may be necessary to help regulate them. The best way to deal with antibodies is to just commence proper thyroid treatment and have the dr treat for the necessary symptoms. One can use the laboratory tests as a diagnostic tool to help guide the proper dosages. As you commence thyroid treatment it may be wise to test the adrenals via salvia test just make sure the thyroid medication does not under cover a hidden cortisol insufficiency. Proper thyroid function is needed to up regulate many nutrient absorption and function with in the body. B-12,iron, magnesium, zinc are ones which are usually affected by improper thyroid levels. With a lag time of zinc metabolism due to low thyroid this could have a huge effect of testosterone from resulting in results from low LH production. Once the thyroid is regulated then the zinc metabolism will normalize. How ever there is a 3-4 month lag time for this to occur once the thyroid is properly optimized.
@MetalMX 245 wrote:
Dr Mariano in terms of bodyweight what dose of armour thyroid would you recommend per lb of bodyweight as a ideal long term dose for people in general?
I am 198-200lbs and 6″4.
I don’t believe there is an “ideal” dose of Armour Thyroid for the treatment of hypothyroidism. It has to be customized for the person.
I usually find doses below 45 mg a day too low – causing an overall reduction in thyroid function. This is why I usually start at 60 mg a day.
Thyroid treatment has to be accompanied by optimization of nutrition since adverse effects such as arrhythmias and congestive heart failure are more likely to occur if this is not done. Thyroid may not work well if low on nutrients.
As I recall (correct me if you know otherwise), in the days before lab tests were available, doctors had to base thyroid treatment on the signs and symptoms patients exhibited. They had to base treatment on the history and physical exam – classic medical skills. In those days, the average dose for an adult with hypothyroidism was about 180 mg of Armour Thyroid a day – based on cllinical response. This, note, is for overtly hypothyroid patients with clear myxedematous changes. This is not for the mildly hypothyroid states which may accompany depression or other mood disorders or hypothyroidism due to normal aging. The optimum dose still has to be adjusted for the individual. Otherwise, one will get into trouble.
Remember that excessive thyroid hormone doses may cause dysregulation of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis, resulting in reduction in cortisol production, resulting in many symptoms and signs of hyperthyroidism.
Judging from my symptoms, when i begin thyroid treatment even a small dose i soon later in the day begin having severe symptoms of low cortisol.
Generalised weakness, difficulty breathing, pulse actually seemed slower and weaker at the 45-50 Bpm range.
I definitly need Isocort or HC with this treatment, my cortisol production is just too low.
I didn’t want to post a new thread. Thought this was appropriate.
I have some new blood tests results in:
I have attached them.
What I speculate will happen and seen a clinical setting is that when the thyroid once being treated may under cover a hidden adrenal issue which could result in the person feeling worse. May times i have seen a person cortisol levels look perfect and very strong on cortisol saliva test, but when given thyroid their cortisol levels take a huge nose dive after 6 weeks on thyroid replacement. T-4 is the standard mode of reducing antibodies and for some people if they are good converters work great. Other people it can send them into unexplained anxiety, depression, weight gain which to a traditional dr results in a trip to see the shrink because they could not give an explanation to why these are occuring when the thyroid is being properly treated. Given the amount of stress your body is under normal cortisol levels may not be functional for your body and not until the adrenals are challenge with thyroid the adrenal imbalance will not be revealed. What came first no one knows but they both have to monitored to see the interaction between the 2. Knowing about your past history I would highly speculate that there may be hidden food allergies, dybiosis and leaky gut potential in your case. Until the testing comes back to verify this will can only speculate.
@hardasnails1973 1071 wrote:
What I speculate will happen and seen a clinical setting is that when the thyroid once being treated may under cover a hidden adrenal issue which could result in the person feeling worse. May times i have seen a person cortisol levels look perfect and very strong on cortisol saliva test, but when given thyroid their cortisol levels take a huge nose dive after 6 weeks on thyroid replacement. T-4 is the standard mode of reducing antibodies and for some people if they are good converters work great. Other people it can send them into unexplained anxiety, depression, weight gain which to a traditional dr results in a trip to see the shrink because they could not give an explanation to why these are occuring when the thyroid is being properly treated. Given the amount of stress your body is under normal cortisol levels may not be functional for your body and not until the adrenals are challenge with thyroid the adrenal imbalance will not be revealed. What came first no one knows but they both have to monitored to see the interaction between the 2. Knowing about your past history I would highly speculate that there may be hidden food allergies, dybiosis and leaky gut potential in your case. Until the testing comes back to verify this will can only speculate.
I avoid wheat, dairy and soy. If i add them back i feel worse so i know not to do this. I have chemical sensitivites to exhaust fumes from trucks and on the motorway sometimes.
Intestinal permiability said i have malabsorbtion but no leaky gut.
GI Stool analysis mentioned positive drug resistant genes:
Drug Resistance Genes:
aacA, aphD – Pos gyrB, ParE – Neg
mecA – Pos PBP1a, 2B – Neg
vanA, B, and C – Neg
Positive for: Enterobius vermicularis
Maybe dr mariano can fill us in on what these drug resistant genes mean?
To my understanding some of those are correlated with MRSA (Methylcillin resistant straphylococcus aureus superbug infection)
I have only been on the thyroid for 3 days and on the third day i noticed feeling like crap, liver aches, swelling of the legs and a slight weight gain around my waist.
God give me strength…
In some believe systems people have to be brought upon their knees in order to take a good look at the direction of where there life is going. I remember laying in bed for 8 months at time wanting to just die and get it over with, but some thing inside of me told me to keep going never to give up. Some times this is a sign above from God for a wake up call because bigger and better things are going to happen. The frustrating thing is waiting for it to happen. What started out as a curse turned into a blessing and now I am able to share my journey with other people. Almost anything people have been through I have came over it. The reason I am so well respected is because I can actually say I understand what you are going through because I have been there personally my self. I was on my way to 80% recovery until the change in formulation of armour that sent me for a tail spin. After 2 years of finally getting my thyroid dialed in its back to square one again. I have basically been a vegetable sleeping all day because of it. I feel your pain and live it each day. When I was at my lowest I went to a lady that told me i was going to be a great healer. I was like WTH was this lady talking about? Now 5 years later look at where I am. Never give up hope and some times in order to get better when all else has failed give it to your faith and let him heal it.
@MetalMX 1069 wrote:
I didn’t want to post a new thread. Thought this was appropriate.
I have some new blood tests results in:
I have attached them.
Generally, I like to see a Total T4 and possibly a Total T3 to help determine how much thyroid hormone to give a person.
A TSH > 20 practically screams for the need for additional thyroid hormone, all else being all right. In cases of high TSH, thyroid signaling needs to be addressed, otherwise the other treatments may not work well.
Recent studies show that autoimmue thyroid disease is due to activation of the inflammatory gene on the DNA called nuclear factor kappa beta with activation of COX-2 enzyme in thyroid cells. There is a free book on the thyroid on the web call http://www.thyroidmanager.net
Im doing much better on armour. I started at 40mg per day. 20mg in the morning and 20mg in the evening due to the half-life of the T3. It has been causing me no problems. While Even small amounts of T4 have caused me liverpains and not helping with any hypo symptoms whatsoever.
I am also adding to this a adrenal cortex extract similar to isocort.
@MetalMX 1173 wrote:
Im doing much better on armour. I started at 40mg per day. 20mg in the morning and 20mg in the evening due to the half-life of the T3. It has been causing me no problems. While Even small amounts of T4 have caused me liverpains and not helping with any hypo symptoms whatsoever.
I am also adding to this a adrenal cortex extract similar to isocort.
If ones norepinepherine levels are elevated an adrenal extract could cause over stimulation
I would run armour for 6-8 weeks then recheck adrenals to make sure you are not causing an imbalance in your adrenals. I have seen this numerous times were people have strong adrenals but when started on thyroid meds it will uncover secondary adrenal insufficency when their functionality is challenged.
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