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Dear Dr. Mariano,
Well, I am back to report that I have gotten my previously pathetic ferritin up to 96! (usually runs btw 30-56) I’m pretty happy about this. I have been using Enzamatic Therapy’s Liquid Liquid liver in conjunction with a 25mg bisglyconate twice per day. My question is that the liquid liver contains soy oil and I have become more hypothyroid since I’ve been using it. In your experience, can soy oil block thyroid hormone?Thank you, sincerely, Chris
I could be wrong but SOY acts like a Estrogen marker not working but one that tells the brains you have to much of it so it slows down the estrogen in women in men it’s the Testosterone because E’s are made from Testosterone and the brain can’t tell the Difference so when this markers levels from SOY are high in men the brain thinks it’s testosterone and slows down sending the LH and FSH message to the testis to make Testosterone also the testis slow down making Thyroid hormones SOY is not good for men.
@misseschris 1128 wrote:Dear Dr. Mariano,
Well, I am back to report that I have gotten my previously pathetic ferritin up to 96! (usually runs btw 30-56) I’m pretty happy about this. I have been using Enzamatic Therapy’s Liquid Liquid liver in conjunction with a 25mg bisglyconate twice per day. My question is that the liquid liver contains soy oil and I have become more hypothyroid since I’ve been using it. In your experience, can soy oil block thyroid hormone?Thank you, sincerely, Chris
Hi Phil! I know that stuff about soy in general, But do you think soy oil has the same effects?- in other words does the oil contain the phytates and phytoestrogens? I’ve also heard it binds with thyroid hormones?? Just wondering what shot up my TSH. I also was leaving 2-3 hours btw thyroid hormone and iron- perhaps not enough time?? I take OTC Nutrimeds thyroid as I cannot tolerate anything else.
@misseschris 1131 wrote:
Hi Phil! I know that stuff about soy in general, But do you think soy oil has the same effects?- in other words does the oil contain the phytates and phytoestrogens? I’ve also heard it binds with thyroid hormones?? Just wondering what shot up my TSH. I also was leaving 2-3 hours btw thyroid hormone and iron- perhaps not enough time?? I take OTC Nutrimeds thyroid as I cannot tolerate anything else.
As far as I know (and I can stand to be corrected), soy oil does not contain phytoestrogens and phytates.
Without iron, cells of the hypothalamus many not work well enough to produce TSH or even monitor thyroid hormone levels well since cellular metabolism is impaired. The cells may not be able to generate enough ATP to do their jobs and process information.
Once iron levels improve, metabolism improves, and the cells may then be able to produce thyroid receptors, and TSH. Perhaps this may cause an increase in TSH should a person be still hypothyroid. Perhaps this would reflect a more accurate TSH since the cells can work well again.
Note that I generally rely more on the actual thyroid hormone levels present than on TSH. When there are metabolic problems, TSH can be completely wrong or at least artificially low compared to the amount of thyroid hormone actually there.
When determining dosing, I find it a lot easier to base dosing on actual thyroid hormone levels than TSH.
This is analogous to basing testosterone replacement on the Total Testosterone rather than the LH level. It makes no sense to use LH, particularly when the pituitary or hypothalamus is not working well, such as in secondary hypogonadims.
Why then would one want to base thyroid hormone replacement on TSH. The actual thyroid hormone levels would give a truer picture of what needs to be done. This is one reason Total T4 is an important level to obtain (Total T3 also if one uses T3 in treatment such as with Armour Thyroid).
Interesting! Well, now perhaps I have more energy to BE hypothyroid! Better get the actual thyroid levels done, then.
Thank you again for your insightful response- always something to ltearn!Chris
Yes I don’t do anything SOY to be safe and I don’t drink out of plastic bottles or nuk food in plastic. It leachs Estrogens into your water and food high Estradiol levels mess up my Thyroid meds they don’t work as will as they do when I keep my Estradiol around 20 pg/ml. Also when I tested my Ferritin I found it below normal as per Dr. M’s posting now on iron pills I am doing much better. When you test your thyroid test your Ferritin and iron levels and Estradiol. I use Quest labs for Estradiol test #4021 the range is 13 to 54 pg/ml anthing thing over 30 for me with my SHBG at 22 I get some bad ED and have Panic Attacks in the middle of the night.
@misseschris 1149 wrote:Interesting! Well, now perhaps I have more energy to BE hypothyroid! Better get the actual thyroid levels done, then.
Thank you again for your insightful response- always something to ltearn!Chris
Dr. Mariano, I started wondering after your comment regarding TSH. I have, many times heard about people who have a low TSH actually being hypothyroid according to their Free T3 and Total T4- my daughter being one of them- in the case of a high TSH, does that ALWAYS mean hypothyroid? Is a TSH valuable as a tool for diagnoses when it is high? Or do you always take into account T4? Thanks again.
@misseschris 1191 wrote:
Dr. Mariano, I started wondering after your comment regarding TSH. I have, many times heard about people who have a low TSH actually being hypothyroid according to their Free T3 and Total T4- my daughter being one of them- in the case of a high TSH, does that ALWAYS mean hypothyroid? Is a TSH valuable as a tool for diagnoses when it is high? Or do you always take into account T4? Thanks again.
If, for whatever reason, the brain is not working well, then TSH may not be a good measure of thyroid hormone activity (be it high or low).
From my point of view, it is easier to determine thyroid activity from the actual production of thyroid hormone (Total T4, Total T3, Free T4, Free T3), and patient signs and symptoms, then to rely on TSH. This, more easily, allows one to determine dosing – analogous to using Total Testosterone to determine replacement dosing, rather than relying on LH levels to determine testosterone dosing.
Thus for example, if TSH is high (e.g. 10), and Total T4 and Free T3 are adequate and a person shows no signs or symptoms hypothyroidism, then perhaps there is some defect in the number of thyroid stimulating hormone receptors or a defect in the structure of thyroid stimulating hormone, itself, so that the TSH signal is not triggering an adequate response and a higher output of TSH is necessary to assure adequate thyroid hormone production. One could call this thyroid stimulating hormone resistance.
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