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My case has recently improved. When I say my case, that is my libido, assertiveness, energy. I found out something about Dr.lam’s protocol. He’s had me on pantethine, various forms of vitamin C and adrenal glandulars. I’ve been on them for months now and there’s been no benefit to speak of, HOWEVER, on the adrenal glandular, I my libido, assertivess, energy improve noticeably, and what’s more, I don’t get those lat PM reactive hypoglycemia episodes anymore. BUT, the thing is this : if I have the adrenal extracts alone I get all of the above, but if I take it along all of the other supplements, then I don’t derive ANY of the above benefits. Dr. Lam has told me that there’s a reason why he gave me the other supplements, and I’ve told him what I’ve noticed. He said to be careful with glandulars as they can bring about a crash as they can overstimulate one. On the other hand, if I take all of the other supps. I no longer get the benefits outlined above. What I thought is that viamin C is a needed cofactor in the making of norepinephrine, and that loading more C could actually increase stress, since when one’s cortisol’s low it appears that one runs on back-up cats. I could be wrong though, but with the limited knowledge that I have, this is what I came up with.
Actually, my question would be : what could possibly cause the other supplements I mentioned above to not negate the benefits of the adrenal glandular I found out works when taken alone ?
I could post that on your forum, actually, I’ll do so now.
Thanks
Vitamin B5 (Panthothenic Acid): in observing the effects of B5 on patients, a problem I have is that I primarily see an improvement in adrenal medulla function. This means an increase in norepinephrine (stress) signaling. This is generally what I don’t want when I want to improve hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis function since it is the adrenal cortex function that I want to improve instead. Increasing norepinephrine signaling can impair adrenal cortex signaling. In adrenal fatigue, it is the cortex that has difficulty producing cortisol, DHEA, pregnenolone, progesterone, and other cortex signals. Thus I haven’t found B5 a useful product. Generally adrenal medulla function is preserved unless there is a nervous system to adrenal medulla disconnect – such as in insulin resistance.
Vitamin C: One of vitamin C’s actions is to slow down adrenal cortex function. In high enough doses, Vitamin C worsens adrenal cortex function. Of course, this is the opposite of what I want to accomplish when improving HPA axis function or when I want to improve adrenal fatigue. Vitamin C is necessary to make aldosterone. These days, I generally limit how much Vitamin C a patient takes to avoid slowing adrenal cortex function.
@DrMariano 59 wrote:
Vitamin B5 (Panthothenic Acid): in observing the effects of B5 on patients, a problem I have is that I primarily see an improvement in adrenal medulla function. This means an increase in norepinephrine (stress) signaling. This is generally what I don’t want when I want to improve hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis function since it is the adrenal cortex function that I want to improve instead. Increasing norepinephrine signaling can impair adrenal cortex signaling. In adrenal fatigue, it is the cortex that has difficulty producing cortisol, DHEA, pregnenolone, progesterone, and other cortex signals. Thus I haven’t found B5 a useful product. Generally adrenal medulla function is preserved unless there is a nervous system to adrenal medulla disconnect – such as in insulin resistance.
Vitamin C: One of vitamin C’s actions is to slow down adrenal cortex function. In high enough doses, Vitamin C worsens adrenal cortex function. Of course, this is the opposite of what I want to accomplish when improving HPA axis function or when I want to improve adrenal fatigue. Vitamin C is necessary to make aldosterone. These days, I generally limit how much Vitamin C a patient takes to avoid slowing adrenal cortex function.
This also goes true with another supplement of Phosphatidyl serine as this supplement can also lower cortisol production. In many of the adrenal protocols for low cortisol it is given as a way to sensitize the HPTA to cortisol. In practice I have found it and along with melatonin to be counter product in helping to raise cortisol as they are antagonistic.
From Dr Marianos post he has mentioned of taking only a small amount of 300-500 mcgs of melatonin before going to be to help sleep. In alot of my clients they begin to try ever supplement on the face of the earth to help cure their issue, but in reality end up making things worse because supplements become conflicting with one another. That is why when I start with a new person I strip what they are taking and start fresh to create a new base and add things in one at time. As we discussed Chip that healing begins with going back to mother nature by getting proper sleep, getting out in the sun, and staying off the computer late at night time so our bodys can recharge with proper melatonin/light cycle. Our society and social skills have gone to hell in a hand basket and we need to go back to what grandparents taught us. When I was driving this weekend it was gorgeous bright and sunny out, but when I looked around i did not see any childern playing out side or people out on the tennis courts. Parents do not encourage their kids to go out side and play any more, but are fine with the fact that they are perfectly contented on the computer to where they are not bothered with them. Just other day I went back to my old high school. I talked to one of my old teachers and said where are all the students at?
They told me that over 50% of after school acitivities where cancelled because there was no participation. So next time just take a look around and you will see what I am talking about how society and our lifestyles have become the worst in the world. Do you ever hear off alot of third word country with high cancer rates? No its more just starvation, and disesae, but rarely ever people die of cancer. The reason why is because they eat natural foods from mother earth. We need to go back to our roots and this is what I highly emphasis in people. When they start making simple changes is when they start to really feel better. Study was done with japenese people that came over to hawaii. It was found that when people took on a 50% SAD diet that cancer rate soared to 60% when people returned to their japan their cancer rate went back to normal. Sugar and soft drinks are basically killing us because they leach minerals from our body putting our body in a diseased state. It is a known fact that sugar feeds cancer. So why are people putting cancer in remission mysteriously? Its because they are going back to eat low glycemic fruits and green vegetables with fresh nuts and seeds with alittle bit of fish and animal products that is why. The reasons drs are not taught nutrition in school is because they do not want you to know about it, but inorder for drug companies to push drugs on you instead. When the drug companies hears of these threats or a supplement that does work they brain wash you into thinking that its bad for you and then pull it off the market.
After 5-6 months it is reintroduced with a new name. FDA that pulls drugs just wait s 6 months then puts them back under a different name and may be adds a few things to make it slightly different, but essential same drug that was pulled off 6 months ago.
If a Dr came out and said that eating fresh fruits, veggies, and raw seeds, and nuts was to help cancer. He be called a quack. There will never be a cure for cancer because it there was trillions of dollars would be lost. Trust me once Jerry Lewis dies a mysterious cure for MD will pop out. Giving donations for breast cancer foundations…HMMM where does that money really go? It goes int the drug companies pockets. Think about it if a cure for cancer was found think about all the universities, dr’s, hospitals, clincs that would not be needed any more? So why would they want a cure?Hi Chip your lucky the adrenal glandulars are working for me and others it was way to late to try this and the only thing that helps is Cortef or HC 20 to 30 mgs total / day in doses of on avg. 5mgs. 4x’s per day. What you need to do to keep your adrenal healthy is to take dam good care of your body. Get a good nights sleep and listen to your body when it’s run down stop whats doing this.
I am on cortef for life when I had heart bypass sugary I had to tell them to RED LINE my chart that I am AI and need HC in big 150mg doses before and after sugary. If I had not done this I would not be here today.
After a time you can come off adrenal glandulars slow and when your off them 2 weeks retest doing a 4x’s in a day saliva test or 24 hr. Urine test to see if your adrenals are working good again. Most people I know with this problems do this every 6 months. Some have good luck off the others don’t change there life style and end up back on meds.
Phil@DrMariano 59 wrote:
Vitamin B5 (Panthothenic Acid): in observing the effects of B5 on patients, a problem I have is that I primarily see an improvement in adrenal medulla function. This means an increase in norepinephrine (stress) signaling. This is generally what I don’t want when I want to improve hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis function since it is the adrenal cortex function that I want to improve instead. Increasing norepinephrine signaling can impair adrenal cortex signaling. In adrenal fatigue, it is the cortex that has difficulty producing cortisol, DHEA, pregnenolone, progesterone, and other cortex signals. Thus I haven’t found B5 a useful product. Generally adrenal medulla function is preserved unless there is a nervous system to adrenal medulla disconnect – such as in insulin resistance.
Vitamin C: One of vitamin C’s actions is to slow down adrenal cortex function. In high enough doses, Vitamin C worsens adrenal cortex function. Of course, this is the opposite of what I want to accomplish when improving HPA axis function or when I want to improve adrenal fatigue. Vitamin C is necessary to make aldosterone. These days, I generally limit how much Vitamin C a patient takes to avoid slowing adrenal cortex function.
This is exactly the type of answer I’ve been looking for ! Thanks a million DrMariano. Though I wasn’t aware of what you wrote above, I’ve been experiencing it first hand over the last 5 months. Today, my case has progressed once more notch thanks to you.
May I know what’s your stance on adrenal glandulars and glandulars at large ? I derive noticeable benefits from adrenal glandular at 80 mg/day. Concerns I’ve seen over glandulars has to do with prions and BSE. I get the glandulars from a company that take them from New Zealand cattle herds bred under strict guidelines, or so they have us think. Quite frankly, I’m not too fond ofingesting glandulars, as I feel they could also bring about some serious issues, but again, this is only my opinion, and please do correct me if mistaken. What I like about them is that they can be gotten without any script and that I get benefits from them, at least so far I have.
Thanks again
@pmgamer18 62 wrote:
Hi Chip your lucky the adrenal glandulars are working for me and others it was way to late to try this and the only thing that helps is Cortef or HC 20 to 30 mgs total / day in doses of on avg. 5mgs. 4x’s per day. What you need to do to keep your adrenal healthy is to take dam good care of your body. Get a good nights sleep and listen to your body when it’s run down stop whats doing this.
I am on cortef for life when I had heart bypass sugary I had to tell them to RED LINE my chart that I am AI and need HC in big 150mg doses before and after sugary. If I had not done this I would not be here today.
After a time you can come off adrenal glandulars slow and when your off them 2 weeks retest doing a 4x’s in a day saliva test or 24 hr. Urine test to see if your adrenals are working good again. Most people I know with this problems do this every 6 months. Some have good luck off the others don’t change there life style and end up back on meds.
PhilHi Phil,
you’re right, you sure wouldn’t be here today, had you not tell them to red line your chart. Your adrenals wouldn’t have been able to mount sufficient a stress response and it’d have been the end. That’s why It’s more than always a good idea for AI patients to wear a medicalert bracelet 24/7. In the instance of a Canadian citizen going on vacation in the U.S.–let’s say he gets into a car accident, rushed to the ER, with no mention of exogenous hydrocortisone requirement, he’ll go into shock and die as a result.
I’m glad I’m getting benefits from glandulars, now let’s see where this takes me.
Hope you’re doing well Phil.
@hardasnails1973 60 wrote:
This also goes true with another supplement of Phosphatidyl serine as this supplement can also lower cortisol production. In many of the adrenal protocols for low cortisol it is given as a way to sensitize the HPTA to cortisol. In practice I have found it and along with melatonin to be counter product in helping to raise cortisol as they are antagonistic.
From Dr Marianos post he has mentioned of taking only a small amount of 300-500 mcgs of melatonin before going to be to help sleep. In alot of my clients they begin to try ever supplement on the face of the earth to help cure their issue, but in reality end up making things worse because supplements become conflicting with one another. That is why when I start with a new person I strip what they are taking and start fresh to create a new base and add things in one at time. As we discussed Chip that healing begins with going back to mother nature by getting proper sleep, getting out in the sun, and staying off the computer late at night time so our bodys can recharge with proper melatonin/light cycle. Our society and social skills have gone to hell in a hand basket and we need to go back to what grandparents taught us. When I was driving this weekend it was gorgeous bright and sunny out, but when I looked around i did not see any childern playing out side or people out on the tennis courts. Parents do not encourage their kids to go out side and play any more, but are fine with the fact that they are perfectly contented on the computer to where they are not bothered with them. Just other day I went back to my old high school. I talked to one of my old teachers and said where are all the students at?
They told me that over 50% of after school acitivities where cancelled because there was no participation. So next time just take a look around and you will see what I am talking about how society and our lifestyles have become the worst in the world. Do you ever hear off alot of third word country with high cancer rates? No its more just starvation, and disesae, but rarely ever people die of cancer. The reason why is because they eat natural foods from mother earth. We need to go back to our roots and this is what I highly emphasis in people. When they start making simple changes is when they start to really feel better. Study was done with japenese people that came over to hawaii. It was found that when people took on a 50% SAD diet that cancer rate soared to 60% when people returned to their japan their cancer rate went back to normal. Sugar and soft drinks are basically killing us because they leach minerals from our body putting our body in a diseased state. It is a known fact that sugar feeds cancer. So why are people putting cancer in remission mysteriously? Its because they are going back to eat low glycemic fruits and green vegetables with fresh nuts and seeds with alittle bit of fish and animal products that is why. The reasons drs are not taught nutrition in school is because they do not want you to know about it, but inorder for drug companies to push drugs on you instead. When the drug companies hears of these threats or a supplement that does work they brain wash you into thinking that its bad for you and then pull it off the market.
After 5-6 months it is reintroduced with a new name. FDA that pulls drugs just wait s 6 months then puts them back under a different name and may be adds a few things to make it slightly different, but essential same drug that was pulled off 6 months ago.
If a Dr came out and said that eating fresh fruits, veggies, and raw seeds, and nuts was to help cancer. He be called a quack. There will never be a cure for cancer because it there was trillions of dollars would be lost. Trust me once Jerry Lewis dies a mysterious cure for MD will pop out. Giving donations for breast cancer foundations…HMMM where does that money really go? It goes int the drug companies pockets. Think about it if a cure for cancer was found think about all the universities, dr’s, hospitals, clincs that would not be needed any more? So why would they want a cure?Amen to the above my friend. I’ve been looking around in order to find a good price on the Adrenocortex stress profile in order to see where my free cortisol is at these days, and then, it’s going to be clearer what needs to be done. Having said that, I now agree with you that it seems to be too low as opposed to too high.
@DrMariano 59 wrote:
Vitamin B5 (Panthothenic Acid): in observing the effects of B5 on patients, a problem I have is that I primarily see an improvement in adrenal medulla function. This means an increase in norepinephrine (stress) signaling. This is generally what I don’t want when I want to improve hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis function since it is the adrenal cortex function that I want to improve instead. Increasing norepinephrine signaling can impair adrenal cortex signaling. In adrenal fatigue, it is the cortex that has difficulty producing cortisol, DHEA, pregnenolone, progesterone, and other cortex signals. Thus I haven’t found B5 a useful product. Generally adrenal medulla function is preserved unless there is a nervous system to adrenal medulla disconnect – such as in insulin resistance.
Vitamin C: One of vitamin C’s actions is to slow down adrenal cortex function. In high enough doses, Vitamin C worsens adrenal cortex function. Of course, this is the opposite of what I want to accomplish when improving HPA axis function or when I want to improve adrenal fatigue. Vitamin C is necessary to make aldosterone. These days, I generally limit how much Vitamin C a patient takes to avoid slowing adrenal cortex function.
What is zinc’s role in adrenal health ? I’ve also found this to help me.
@chipdouglas 68 wrote:
What is zinc’s role in adrenal health ? I’ve also found this to help me.
I also derive benefits from Thyroplex, and glandular supplement containing the following :
proprietary blend 390mg :
thyroid tissue
adrenal tissue
pituitary tissue
thymus tissue
spleen tissue
kelpAfter having even half of cap of this, it takes about 20 minutes for both my feet to get delightfully warm–the difference is very noticeable and pleasant. Overall, I’m perhaps a tad more composed as well.
Also, ever since I started on the protocol of that Dr. my appetite has gone nearly out of control, which was quite a bit under control before I embarked on that regimen.
Having said that, I’ve stopped taking pantethine and vitamin C. I needed to understand why it was doing what it’s done to me, and knowing why it’s done so has brought peace of mind.
Chip here is a good link I have about Adrenals and Thyroid hope it helps.
http://www.livingnetwork.co.za/healingnetwork/adrenals_thyroid.html
Phil
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